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[00:00:00] Welcome back folks. Another episode of It's About Payroll. We are somewhere in the early 200s. We will get count. I think this is 208. We'll get count again at some point. What's up Walt? What's going on mate?
[00:00:17] Just grateful. Trying to live and operate in gratefulness man. Just thankful for all the listeners. Thankful for everything that I have. The downloads, life man. Just thankful for it man. How about you man? Same here bro. Same here man. Super excited. Having a lot of fun with the cohort with CPT, our Certified Payroll Technician course. First cohort is in week four now.
[00:00:42] We got two more weeks man. It's just amazing bro. It's so amazing man. I'm so excited for it and the students are excited. Folks are excited. Shout out to Nerd Outfitters. Our good friend colleague Troy Markison out there. Shout out to all the other influence out there. Work Define Network and Career Learning. I saw everyone had given us the support and it was courageous and bold enough to go on this journey with us. You know what I mean?
[00:01:13] Yeah. Yeah. All right. So do you have any payroll in the news? I got, I found another extreme crime thing. I was like waiting, probably overkill to shoot crime on top of crime. So I'll give a, I have a payroll fitness tip for our payrolls out there.
[00:01:31] And it's build a payroll dashboard or dashboards, depending on what the metrics you need. Sometimes the systems will help you build this and they may have it already. I've seen systems that have the dashboards and nobody's looking at it. Either way, you gotta need clean data. If not, you could get an Excel. You can use AI to help build this as well. Cause you don't need any PII to build, to use the data. Right.
[00:01:57] Um, but some of the examples that I have is overtime by location. What it reveals is scheduling inefficiency, meal penalties by location. It reveals compliance and staffing issues, retro pay volume.
[00:02:15] It reveals late HR or manager changes, manual checks and obstacles. We know how that goes. That reveals a process breakdown. Oh my gosh. That is like giving me trip. That's triggering me right now. Payroll error rate. Another trigger, which reveals training or system issues. And then benefit. Arrears balance is which could reveal some deduction set up problems.
[00:02:43] So there's little things that I can help a payroll pro add some values to their organization. Yeah, man. I love that. That's great stuff, man. So perfect segue into our. True payroll crime story today. So you want to give us an intro to it, man? Absolutely. Imagine discovering that someone entrusted your company's payroll had allegedly increased. Wait, let me restart over.
[00:03:12] Imagine that you found that someone that is entrusted with processing your company's payroll had allegedly increased their own salary and issued themselves bonuses as large as $25,000 and used company credit card. Hundreds of thousand dollars racking up and personal expenses, not just business, not business expenses. So now imagine that this continued for more than two years.
[00:03:42] Ding, ding, ding. What's that magic number? Walt found for us, right? These things go on for about 18 to 18 to 24 months on average. So more than two years. Today, a true payroll crime story. We are discussing the case of a Florida payroll manager accused of stealing more than 1.5 million from a Miami doctor's office. But this is not simply a story about one employee who allegedly acted dishonest.
[00:04:12] It is a classic story about unrestricted system access, missing approvals or segregation duties, weak account verification and payroll reports that apparently were not independently reviewed. We talk about that stuff over and over and over. It leads back to this theme controls. Right. So like not to get too far over, but we don't have to wonder how to fix this.
[00:04:42] The right is foundational. Corrections is fundamental stuff that governs this, that is just not in place. So what? Let me ask you this on a single person can change their own salary, create their own bonus, approve their own payments and control the payroll account. What could possibly go wrong? Apparently about 1.5 million worth of things can go wrong, bro. Hmm.
[00:05:11] And today we're going to break down what allegedly happened, identify some failed controls, failed controls and test ourselves with several payroll crime prevention series scenarios. See how we do from net. But tell us, yeah. Yeah. Tell us what we are coming right, sir.
[00:05:32] So according to authorities, I'm not going to put the lady's name up there, but this employee was a payroll manager or payroll manager, our pay master for Miami back and neck specialists and orthopedic medical practice in Miami.
[00:05:48] So medical investigators alleged that from approximately September of 2021 through January of 2024, she altered her own payroll information without the doctor's knowledge or authorization. She allegedly increased her by-the-piece salary by approximately $1,700 and issued herself unauthorized bonuses. Some reportedly as large as 25 K like Brian mentioned. Wow.
[00:06:14] Authorities claim that, yeah, authorities claim that the unauthorized salary increases and bonuses total approximately a little over $1 million. She is also accused of making approximately over $400,000 in unauthorized personal purchases using the company credit card. Together, the allegations exceed 1.5 milli.
[00:06:37] So it was reportedly uncovered after a new payroll manager joined the organization in 2024 and noticed suspicious activity in the former payroll manager's records. The physician who owned the practice then filed a police report in June of 2024. So Brian, what's the first thing that jumps out to you?
[00:07:03] The first thing that jumps out to me is that fraud was not discovered by a routine audit, but it was discovered by the new person who came in and started looking at old records. The same. The same. As soon as you said that it totaled a million over the time frame, like, wait a minute, is there like accountant not even asking? Like, Hey, you went up a million dollars in expenses this past year. What happened even month to month?
[00:07:27] Like if you, if you're operating in the millions, you need outside third party or someone. I mean, it doesn't have to be outside someone looking at the numbers and comparing your numbers on a constant basis month over month. That date over check date. What's going on? Hey, this went up and don't ask the payroll person. Don't have to ask the owner, right?
[00:07:51] Like the, the payroll, you can copy them in, but I would write. So that suggests a normal payroll review process item did not exist, was, was not independent or was not detailed enough to detect changes involving the payroll manager itself. I mean, I don't even know. Oh, oh my gosh. I got it.
[00:08:20] So how, so how do you think this worked? How did it, how did she get this to work, man? So let's dig into that. The most alarming allegation may be how the payroll accountant, the payroll account was established. Investigators claim that poor, oh, that the person it's, it's almost like a, it's all right. It's like, oh, it was like a play on words. Cause this person's last thing was poor.
[00:08:42] Claim that the descendant represented herself as the owner when setting up the company's account with its payroll process. That allegedly gave her full administrative and supervisory access, including the ability to manage employee salaries, create bonuses, approve payments and control account level permissions.
[00:09:29] By the way, you don't need that level owner. And that's a way to make sure that you have oversight, even if the owner is complaining like, oh, I don't want to get it. Oh, you got it. You got it. I'm like, Hey, but you gotta be like, Hey, this is not our business. Not my business. Right. Yep. You, this is your account. You got to do this. So in other words, she allegedly had access to change payroll data, change her own compensation, create bonus payments, approve payroll activity, manage system permissions and control.
[00:09:55] Who else could see or challenge the activity again, access that we could and should have for the most part, but with oversight. This is not simply a payroll problem. It is an access and governance failure as well. Like I'm suggesting. So what should a payroll manager do if they ever had full administrative access?
[00:10:21] So look, they legitimately may need like significant access like that to perform their job duties. Right. The, it's not necessarily the problem in itself is not necessarily the access. It's the access without, like you said, the independent oversight. Right. So the payroll person that should not be able to make a change to their own compensation. That's a system configuration thing. And then be the only person.
[00:10:48] And also they should never be the only person reviewing and approving that sort of change. Like, look, there's been, there's been, I've been in systems where I could change my own salary. Of course. If I wanted to. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? And I've never, never done that. And it, there's a lot of different failures across the board. Right. I want to know where their accounting team was. Like you mentioned, what's their finance person doing? Like it's, was this payroll person in charge of that stuff too?
[00:11:17] Like, was it just a, were they doing payroll and were they also the bookkeeper? You know what I'm saying? So if they were then of course, they're walking, working in a silo. They could do all those things, man. So it's a, it's definitely control failures all the way around, man. So, and that, and that, that goes into no segregate, no segregation of duties. So you have one person like allegedly who could have the ability to play God in the system and no nobody to check that. That's a problem, right? Yep.
[00:11:45] So at a minimum, you need compensation authorization or workflow. You need to monitor the payroll data entry, payroll approvals, funding authorization, bank reconciliation, system security administration. Those are all different things that should be in question. And especially like you said earlier, if you're, you're a high revenue on the millions, hundreds of thousands in revenue, you need to have those things secure. Like, like what do you always say?
[00:12:12] Trust, but verify that this person probably had a impeccable payroll processing record. They probably had never, well, who knows now if this person did had ever done this in other stops. Right. So it was just like, now, now whoever hired that person before is going to go probably look back and say, like, if they get one of this and say, Oh, let me go check our books. For real. Yeah. Because this person had the same access because imagine this person was only there. This person had already left when the new payroll manager came in, this person was already gone.
[00:12:42] So this person was probably was trying to hightail it out of town and maybe moving on to the next gig. Yep. So like, yeah. They ain't more quick enough. Apparently. Yeah. So payroll professionals should be generally, in my opinion, be prevented from making unreviewed changes to their own salary, hourly rate bonuses, direct deposit. Not so much like, like, look, you have to have an audit in place for a direct deposit. Right. You should be able to change your own. Right. Right. And stuff like that.
[00:13:12] Expense reimbursements. That's neat. That needs to be checked. Right. You shouldn't be able to enter your own expense reimbursement into the system and pay yourself. Oh, you know what? I took my family out to eat on the weekend. I'm gonna say that it was a work thing so I can give myself a reimbursement and pay myself back. You shouldn't be able to do that. Right. You shouldn't be able to also change your employment status.
[00:13:33] So a system has to have the capability to limit these things, or you need to have a policy or workflow that should require another authorized person to initiate those or approve them. Yeah. Same thing with the bonuses, right? Those, those things fall into place. Right. So this also means like who was reviewing the payroll registers, bro? Yeah. Was anybody reviewing those things? You know what I'm saying? Or if it was, it was way late. Yeah. Yeah, man.
[00:14:02] So, bro, let's, let's get into some multiple choice questions here. And this is the new segment I wanted to try out. So. Could you stop the payroll crime? That's so, yes. That's interesting. Okay. So let's see. Are you an HR or talent leader trying to figure out how to have the biggest impact on your business and your people? Listen, you're busier than ever, but you're also under more pressure than ever before.
[00:14:30] The We're Only Human podcast has been running for over 10 years, helping leaders get a handle on these topics. I'm Ben Eubanks, the host of the show. And I started my career as an HR practitioner and executive. Now I run a research firm dedicated to exploring the trends affecting work and the workplace. We cover research from a practical lens, technology changes, compelling case studies and more so that you can get back to work and have the impact you've always wanted to. And we do it with some fun. Check out the We're Only Human podcast today.
[00:15:00] We will put out a scenario, right? And then reveal the control that gives the organization the best chance for preventing that fraud. Okay. So I'll do the number. I'll do one. Well, how many we got? I'll do half. We got five or I'll do the first two or three. We got six. So I got half and half. I'll do the first three. Okay. Here we go.
[00:15:23] So let's see a payroll administrators raise your payroll administrator received the salary increase. The administrator normally answers all salary changes into the payroll system. What is the safest process? A let the administrator answer the increase because payroll already has access. B let the administrator enter it because, but, but ask them to email HR afterward could be.
[00:15:51] C require another authorized employee to enter or approve the administrator's compensation change using, using written support or D wait until year end to confirm the amount on the employees. It's D. I mean, so what do you, what do you think? Bro, it's going to be for me like a B was okay, but the best, the safest process was practice. C. Yes.
[00:16:21] Right. Require another authorized employee to enter or approve the administrator's compensation change using written support. Explanation. No employee should have sole control over changes affecting their own compensation. There is even some systems will limit the, the, the, it'll give an administrator full access except to their own info. So that's a good feature.
[00:16:49] If you can implement it, the increase should be supported by formal authorization entered or independently approved by someone else and included in a compensation change order report. So that's a good question. Yes, sir. All right. Number two, the unexpected $20,000 bonus like that. Um, during, during payroll review, a CFO notices a $20,000 bonus for the payroll manager. The payroll manager says the owner verbally approved it.
[00:17:20] Okay. Yeah. Brian said I could have it. Brian. Right. Right. I mean, what should happen? A process it because payroll deadlines are tight. B process it and obtain the documentation later. No, thank you. C remove or hold the payment until written authorization is independently confirmed. D divide the bonus over two payroll.
[00:17:49] So it attracts less attention. Yeah, sure. Um, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what. What do you think? Well, bro, like, so the, there's only one optimal only one. The rest of those are like suspect. Yes. All the way around. Yes. If you're right. Remove or hold the payments. The written authorization is independently confirmed. If your CFO agrees to anything else, he is also in cahoots with this scheme.
[00:18:19] Well, the explanation is that the material bonus payments should not be processed basically based solely on verbal authorization from the person receiving the payment written approval should come directly from an authorized leader and be retained with the payroll documentation. Absolutely. It shouldn't be in verbal on anybody's account. Yeah. And like you were saying, like the CFO may be in on it in that case, or they, it may be somewhere new, right?
[00:18:48] Someone new that's coming in. Doesn't know. Oh, that's a good. Oh, this is the way. Don't worry. Yeah. And they're kind of taking advantage of it. So like, good CFOs, even if they're new, they would probably challenge that, but you never know. He's fair. Uh, all right. Last one. And then we'll take it over. Full administrator access. A small business has only one payroll employee. That employee needs broad access to process payroll. What is the best compensating control?
[00:19:19] A, give the employee unrestricted access because the company is too small to separate responsibilities, which could be true, but there's better ways. B, have the owner independently review the payroll register, change reports and bank withdrawals every pay period. C, change the payroll password every six months. D, ask employees to report any concerns about the checks. What do you think, Walt? B. B.
[00:19:49] Yeah. Have the owner independently review payroll register reports every pay period. Yes. Yeah. And look, to your point, as a small business owner, you're going to want to have control over those things anyway. Yes. Yes. Because it's going to be vital for the longevity of your business. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I get, I look, as founders, we know it gets busy. Yeah. You're juggling multiple days.
[00:20:17] You got long days, long jobs, and you don't want to do everything. Right? And they'll teach you that if you learn about small business owner, entrepreneur, like you can't do everything, but this is one of the things that you have to maintain. Oh my gosh. You know who I just thought of Tabitha when she came on and she told what she told her assistant, I love you, but I don't trust you. Or the, whoever the person was helping her with the, with her finances. She was like, I love you, but I don't trust you.
[00:20:47] And she, right Tabitha Brown, she, she maintained that she stays with governance over her finances. You could delegate a lot of things, but understanding your fire. Remember you're thinking about it now, right? Yeah. Cause she said she could feel money leaving her account. Like it works every matter of sleep. Like money just left my account. Like, bro, I'm going to be connected to money like that. Like what? Yes. Oh God. God bless us.
[00:21:17] Uh, yes, that was a good show. To keep that show with Tabitha. She had us all laughing, but it was all true. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So in a couple of organizations, you may not have enough staff to complete the segregation of duties. But in that situation, the owner, a CFO and accountant or an outside advisor should perform an independent and documented review of the finances. And even if the owner doesn't do it, like, even if you take that route, okay, I'm going to hire somebody to do it.
[00:21:46] You still have to be diligent about the review of it. Right? Cause if you don't read the review, like there's still no point in it. Tabitha, she said once a month or however frequently she said they, she literally ticks and ties all the transactions out of her account with whoever else that she's working. You know what I mean? And that her and her husband were very diligent about tracking finances out the gate, all their curve, their whole relationship. So stick to that.
[00:22:15] Like, yes, you got to delegate things, but if you're in the business to make money, then track it and pay attention to it. Um, well, why? Why are you reading? I'm just gonna refill my coffee. Go ahead. I'm here. I'm listening. Go ahead. I'm listening. So look, Brian, you're a business owner, right? So your payroll manager set up a organization for a new vendor service. And they listed themselves as the account owner.
[00:22:45] What should you as the owner do? A nothing because the payroll manager will use the account. Most frequently. B list an actual owner or authorized officer as the primary account owner and assign payroll staff role-based access. C allow the payroll manager to remain the owner, but share the password with the CEO. Or D use one shared administrator accounts for everyone. What'd you think? B.
[00:23:16] B. B is the answer. Yeah. Yep. Absolutely. Because look, the primary ownership relationship should be connected to a verified company owner or officer, right? Yes. One of the terms that I recently learned responsible party, right? Oh yeah. So you just had a change in CEO and stuff like that. And you have to fill out tax form or form 8822. Oh yeah. For the IRS to change the responsible party. Dropping James on them. Nice. Yeah.
[00:23:46] So the party needs to be the owner or authorized officer, right? Playroll employees should receive individual accounts with permissions appropriate to their responsibilities and password sharing should be prohibited. Absolutely. All right. Next question. All right. Bro, one of your employees, one of your payroll employees pay just recently shot up, right? So you're comparing, you showed a comparison report and shows that one of your payroll team employees
[00:24:16] gross pay increased by 60% from the period, the previous pay period. What's your best response? A assume it's correct because payroll process and you have to trust your payroll team, right? B review the employees pay rate, history, bonus details, approval documents, and audit logs before releasing payroll. Ask the employee, whether the payment is correct.
[00:24:43] And then D process the payroll and review the difference next quarter. This is William Tincup. And I'd like to talk to you a little bit about indeed future works. Ryan, I attended the conference last year and we created a limited series for indeed, where we talk to their customers. Great stories around TA and how they use indeed to the max. So check it out.
[00:25:10] It's just indeed future works, 2024. You could search for it wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks. Say B review the employees pay rate bonus approval audit log before release in payroll. Come on. Absolutely. Because the review has to rely on independent evidence, not an explanation from your payroll person on why they're receiving the money. Right. You should review source documents.
[00:25:39] Check that the system here, history change logs, who the approver is and, and during the payroll calculation review before you finalize payroll. So last question, brother, a payroll manager has not taken a full week of vacation in three years and insists that no one else can process payroll. I've like, what's the most appropriate response. A, a you reward that employee's dedication.
[00:26:09] B you require cross training and periodic time away while another qualified person performs and reviews the process. C you allow the employee to work remotely during vacation. It's not good. God, for real D you give the employee another administrator administrator account as backup. What do you do, bro? I'm going to go with B there.
[00:26:33] Require cross training period, like time away while another, while their backup can review and do the payroll. Like why, but yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Because schemes often require that one person being in a silo who is committing payroll by themselves and they, they want to continuously be involved. So those irregularities are not discovered. Right.
[00:27:00] So you want to have full, you like, you want to say like, keep everybody out and safeguard yourself from getting caught. Right. You think, yes. A few things come to mind there. One, my, one of my first payroll boss taught me if you don't even want to know the job. Not a, that's not a good thing. Right. That's not job security. Right. Cause leadership. The, the company needs to understand what you, for every role is doing in any, any role. Okay.
[00:27:29] That's one thing. Um, two, I've had this happen because we've both been involved in companies that do mergers and acquisitions. Right. And now as independent consultants and fractional payroll professionals to providing managed payroll services, I've heard both new managers that have come on and clients, former clients, current client.
[00:27:59] You, you find out a lot in that discovery conversation about payroll review, right? Like they know they're doing something wrong. Yeah. And when you have that conversation, because payroll is so intimate, you will find that these folks have a hard time having the conversation. Yep. If they have a hard time doing payroll review, that's the problem. Right. There's no good sign there.
[00:28:28] If it's ignorance, hopefully they feel safe enough to just say, I've never known how to do this. I'm sorry if it's wrong, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they then, Hey, it's the legitimate. Don't worry. This it's you didn't, if you never knew what you never knew, no worries. You just took over. Hey, that happens. Especially in when you acquire small businesses that mom and pop legacy or single owner for a long time.
[00:28:55] And, and when they're small in numbers, they are very rarely payroll compliant. Okay. Yeah. And the same is true when, and the same thing is true as an independent business owner. And now, and as I do consulting and we do services is like you have that interview with the clients and you know, if they're avoiding and they, Oh, well, no, we'll get to it. Don't worry. You'll figure it out. I don't, and they don't want to tell you what they did.
[00:29:22] And it's like, why are you hiding the process here? What? You know? No, no, no, no. You, you, you just, you just do what I probably did wrong. You should just do it how you want to do it. And it's like, well, it's not how I want to do it. I need to understand how it gets done. So I understand some of the nuances that I don't want to miss. Right.
[00:29:44] If you miss a nuance and somebody doesn't get paid properly, but then again, any, if they're avoidant like that, if they start getting defensive, then they know good and well, that's some, they're doing something wrong. And they don't want to be discovered. So that's what that made me think of right there, man. All right. Yeah, bro. What else? As we wrap it up. Good episode. So good story too, man. Holy cow. Yeah, bro.
[00:30:13] So what lessons can be learned from this in your opinion, bro? I see it is both. It's for employers and payroll service providers. Right. So for the employers and as the payroll pros that could be kind of synonymous. Right. And also for our payroll service provider, if you're a payroll person that wants to do your own service is not a control. It reminds me of an HR leader that said, hope is not a strategy. Okay.
[00:30:40] A long-term employee may be trusted, but still require oversight. Okay. Controls protect the organization, but they also protect honest payroll professionals from false accusations. I that. Oh my gosh. That is so true. Right. Because you don't want to. As a payroll pro. We don't have to rely on.
[00:31:06] Oh, my word is my bond and trust me and trust me and no, we don't. I don't have to do that because let's just look at the black and white. Let's look at the video tape. Let's look at the records. Let's look at the order controls. That is how I want to trust you. Right. Right. Because it shouldn't be about trust in a business that can be so well documented. Right. I get in some businesses. Yeah. Maybe it is trust. Maybe you got to trust your lawyer to, cause you can't, right? Cause you can't really. Yeah.
[00:31:36] I don't know how he's going to defend me in this case. And oh my God, you got to build that trust on the track record that he establishes for you. For a parent person. No one thing like you can easily just point to the error and point to the root cause. Shout out to Tim O'Shea. He's he, he, he's, he's the first one that challenged me to, to ask the five why's. I remember what he did. I was like, ah, what is that overkill?
[00:32:03] And as I went through the process with them and I get it because I can ask you why you give me an answer. But I asked, if I asked you why again, it's going to force you to keep digging, right? Oh, but why do you do that? And why do you do that? And why do you do that? So you got to make sure that you get to the point where you're starting to repeat yourself in the answer. Cause then you've gotten to the root cause.
[00:32:28] But if you give me a different why every time I ask why, then we got to keep digging. Right? So the owner must remain involved. That is a huge one. Even when payrolls outsource the employee, the employer retains responsibility for reviewing payroll activity and maintaining proper authority over the account. Small businesses are not exempt from internal controls. So I'm gonna say it again. Small businesses are not exempt from internal controls.
[00:32:59] A smaller organization may use compensating controls, including owner review, outside accounting, a bank alert, dual authorizations, payroll variance reports, and periodic external audits. Payroll staff compensation deserves in the review. Okay. And changes involving employees with payroll system access should automatically route to the independent approver.
[00:33:26] But what about the lessons for the payroll providers? The lessons for the payroll provider is you should consider safeguards such as review, verify the true owner or authorized officer. Right. And, and payroll provided, even as consultants, right. If we're setting things up for our clients. If you're getting contracts signed, are you an officer of the business that are signing the contract? Okay, great. Boom. So that's verify the true owner or officer of the business.
[00:33:56] Requiring additional authentication for ownership changes. Sending alerts when administrative permissions change. Alerting owners about unusual large compensation changes. Require dual approval for high dollar bonuses. And maintain detailed and accessible audit logs. Meaning you should be delivering those logs to those owners. So yes. Look, before I pass it to you, sir.
[00:34:24] Technology cannot eliminate dishonesty. But properly configured technology can make dishonest behavior harder to conceal. I love that. I did that, yeah. Yes, sir. All right. So final verdict and for everything. Look, so the criminal allegations in this case have yet to be proven at trial. The defendant has pled not guilty and has requested a jury trial.
[00:34:52] So, but regardless of the final legal outcome, the reported facts are for a powerful payroll control lesson, right? One individual allegedly had the ability to alter compensation, create those bonuses, approve payroll activity control out account permissions. So that's suspicious. That's suspicious activity appears to have remained undiscovered until a new payroll manager reviewed the records.
[00:35:21] The takeaway is not that employers should distrust, distrust payroll professionals. The takeaway is that no honest payroll professional should be placed in a system where their work is never independently reviewed. Amen. So here's a quote about honesty and payroll. So payroll runs on numbers, but it survives on honesty. Every payment must be supported.
[00:35:48] Every change must be visible and no person should be beyond. Right. Nope. Yep. Good controls. They don't come from accused people of being dishonest. Good controls make honesty measurable, reviewable and defensible. Welcome to this meeting should have been a podcast where we take on workplace issues from a skewed angle. No corporate buzzwords, you quiet quitters. And no strategic KPIs or dashboards. Get out of here.
[00:36:17] We're talking company culture, leadership, workplace. Guests who've lived through the chaos. So forget those slide decks. We're candid, clever, hopefully useful. We'll see you outside the boardroom. Go Lakers. Don't wear that. No, I get out. Don't even wear that hat. Yep. And like you said, you can't have that one person that can do everything. No. Enter it, approve it, fund it and hide it. That is not payroll control. Look, man.
[00:36:43] And so look, we're going to invite you to continue to listen out for our future true payroll crime stories that we produce. And look, I thought that we were going to run out of material for these things. Yes. But it was like people are getting tempted all the time and payroll. So man. Oh my gosh. I was thinking that while we were running through this, like, remember once upon a time we thought, oh, we're going to run out. We're going to be able to do a couple of stories. Well, I was like, oh, we're going to run out of stuff.
[00:37:13] We're 200 episodes later. Plus we're actually probably in almost in the 300 with both of the shows. Not all of those are true crime, of course. But we've you figure like every few episodes is a true crime for over four years or three or four years now. Like, and it doesn't stop. We could. I almost thought, oh, should we throw a little true crime in every episode? Just start like tease it or whatever. But because it's so much, it's like, oh, my goodness. Plus. Yeah.
[00:37:42] And bro, thank God. Thank God. Knock on wood. Knock on wood. But like, thank God that nobody we know has been caught up in these things. Oh, gosh. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. No, no, no. Oh, gosh. Yeah. No, I don't want to be out. Yeah. Yeah. But that, hey, look, that's a testament to our network and everybody we know and assess what's up.
[00:38:08] But look, until the next time, subscribe, like share. Tell a friend to tell a friend and keep coming back. Keep listening and tell us what you want to hear. If again, I mean, I think we keep it pretty diverse, but if there's anything we're missing and we haven't done or folks you want to see on the show that haven't been on yet, let us know or back on the show. If you want to see Walt dance in the salsa and cha cha, let us know. We'll put post that. Oh, man. Let us know.
[00:38:38] Yeah. But until next time, we love you, folks. Peace. Peace. Peace.
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