Are These the Worst Job Interviews on the Internet?

[00:00:00] What would you do if your interviewer started yelling at you about professionalism? Well, first of all, the irony of that. Yeah, well, that actually happened. And somehow it's not even the strangest interview story we've heard. We've got interviewers asking to see someone's chat GPT history, CEOs with secret hiring tests, and candidates being judged by the trash on the office floor. Oh my gosh.

[00:00:23] So today we're going to look at some of the worst job interviews on the Internet, and we're asking what any of this actually has to do with finding the right person for the job. Because sometimes the biggest red flag in an interview is the person asking the questions. Let's get into it. Welcome to Don’t Tell Me About Yourself, the podcast where old school hiring meets a modern reality check. I'm Lorna Erickson. And I'm Victoria Gates. And we're the co-founders of Expert Interviewers. Between the two of us, we've got 40 years of hiring experience. We've studied interviewing techniques.

[00:00:53] We've trained thousands of people globally to stop making the same mistakes over and over again. And we've got 340,000 people following us online because apparently everyone has a story about a bad interview. You know the ones. The illegal questions, the 45-minute monologues, showing up late with no apology. So every week we're tackling the biggest subjects in hiring. We bring real stories, real data, and real talk about how to make interviews actually work for everyone. Because great hiring isn't luck. It's a practice skill.

[00:01:22] So whether you hire, apply, or just love a good interview train wreck, the show is for you. So the first internet interview viral moment that I'm thinking about is the iced coffee one. Because we've talked about it and we've seen so much commentary about it. I know you've heard of it, but for the listeners who haven't, should I do a quick recap of it? You've got to break it down. In all its glory. Yes. So there was a recruiter. Her name was Caitlin on TikTok.

[00:01:50] And she went viral for basically she's a recruiter and she was giving advice. So she said a lot of her Gen Z candidates have been bringing iced coffee into interviews. And essentially her argument was like, if you show up with an iced latte, you're making the interview kind of seem like a stop on your day. You went to Target, Starbucks, and then you're stopping at this interview. And it just doesn't make it seem like you're taking it seriously. And when I say the internet was divided on this, that doesn't even capture it.

[00:02:20] Some people agreed with her that it's too casual. And other people were like, let me bring my coffee. And then some interviewers were like, well, bring one for me. I don't care if you bring it. Just bring it for me. So I'm curious, Lorna, if you have an interview and you want a nice coffee, let's settle this here and out. Are you going to bring it? So again, I'm not a candidate coach, but if I want an iced coffee, I want an iced coffee. If that's going to make it, sometimes it's just an emotional support coffee. This is going to make me feel like my best self. I'm bringing a coffee with me. What about you?

[00:02:50] Yeah. I mean, look, I probably, I'm going to be honest. I probably wouldn't bring an iced coffee because A, I don't drink coffee. So I'm going to be real. I'm going to be real here. But if I did, or if I wanted a diet soda or whatever, I do drink, whatever my vice is, I would bring it. I understand all the reasons why people say to not do it. I think we are team. The interviewer shouldn't care either way. That shouldn't impact the hiring decision.

[00:03:15] At the end of the day, that's where I think we get lost or caught up in it is candidates should do whatever they want. And something like that feels coachable. It does. I don't know. Yeah. And our take on it is we've always flipped this around a little bit. If the interviewer walks in with an iced coffee, does that change something? Yeah. Should a candidate not consider an interviewer because they have an iced coffee? Totally. That's the stupidest. I think, and the burning question that just always sits in my brain with this debate is,

[00:03:43] are we seriously deciding if we should hire someone based on their beverage order, what they're bringing in their hand to the interview? Right. I just think we're focusing on the wrong things. Yeah. That's how I feel about it. Yeah. And everyone has a different definition of what professionalism actually is. And when we were having a conversation with our good friend, Danielle Farage, a Gen Z expert, she's just saying, listen, we weren't trained on this. We got out of college during COVID.

[00:04:11] Who was supposed to teach us what the older generation thought was professional? And when we think of it that way, I'm like, God, it's such a subjective thing that it's like, why are we putting so much emphasis on professionalism when it's something that can be coached? Yeah, I agree. It's like, and are we defining professionalism across the board and what's coachable and what's not? And what we're, I think that's just, it goes back to everything we teach. So that one was a good one. That one was a juicy one.

[00:04:41] The juiciest. Do you remember the one, and we commented on this as well. Most of these we're probably going to have made content around. What can we say? We can't. We love a dumpster fire of an interview story. It's kind of one of our favorite things. Yeah, it is. Do you remember the one we made about the woman who wore shorts to an interview? This was a while ago. You're going to have to break this one down. Oh, okay. So a woman went viral because she, I think it was a tech company and she wore black shorts and a white top.

[00:05:09] And the recruiter basically said she had to go home and change and she declined. So the video generated millions of views. People were arguing, are shorts appropriate? Are they not? And then we've also had a video where someone showed a very tailored outfit, a turtleneck, a trench coat, and she was told it was too casual and she had too much jewelry on for the workplace. So there's a lot of commentary around too casual, overdone.

[00:05:36] Should you be able to wear a cropped shirt that hits the top of your pants or is that too casual? So there's all this viral stories about workplace clothing. And I'm just curious to hear your take. Are these things like an automatic no? What should we be thinking about with these? Gosh. And it's so hard. So because I don't give Canada advice, I think about what would I do?

[00:06:00] And if I had the sickest outfit that I felt great in and they were longer knee length shorts or something, what are those called? Like Bermuda shorts? I don't know. But it's like if those things were super cute with kitten heel and a collared shirt and I was feeling so good about myself, I would totally wear that because what's the difference between a pair of shorts and a skirt? Yeah. Like there's extra fabric between my thighs. I'm like, is that a problem? No, I agree.

[00:06:28] What do you think about the person, the recruiter sent asking the person to go home? Is that reasonable? The biggest cringe I've ever heard in my life. Can you imagine? You need to, you just sound like a school principal. It's like, well, you go home and change and then come back. That's the stupidest thing ever. And it's like, if it's really not appropriate for your workplace, that's fine. Just let them know next time if you come back for your first day, come back for the next interview, let's wear pantalones.

[00:06:56] Well, one question I have for that recruiter too is, did you prep the candidate with what I've seen and I've been on shadowing interviews or seen interviews where the candidate shows up totally professional and the interviewer's in a hoodie and a hat. So it's like, what are you as the company hiring manager recruiter? What are you, are you defining professional dress and expectations prior? Because if you're not, then it's kind of fair game from my perspective, because it's fair game for you to show up in a hat or a hoodie.

[00:07:24] So if a candidate does it and you didn't tell them that they don't, you're just making assumptions. I think you're, you're just a jerk. That's why I agree. I totally judge him for it. I totally agree. Why not just get it, just get it out in the open to begin with. They can't follow directions that's been ever given them. Yeah. Yeah. And if you're not defining it, I just think you're just setting everyone up for, for failure because the expectation should be that if you expect, if you have something you expect, you should be communicating it beforehand.

[00:07:54] Otherwise those expectations need to be maybe a little looser. That's what I would say. Because there are lines. I think we can all agree. There are certain lines that you don't want to cross on either side. However, if a candidate, imagine a candidate saying to the interviewer, hey, you're dressed super casual is distracting me like your hoodie and your hat. Could you, could you change and we can reschedule this? Yes. Yes. It's insane. The golden rule of interviewing, when you put it that way, it sounds absolutely insane.

[00:08:23] And I don't 100% know where that line is. I mean, every company is going to be different. We can all agree that you can't show up in a bathing suit. Well, hold on. What if I'm interviewing to be a waitress on the beach at a resort? A bathing suit model? By all means. You're right. Every company is going to have their own standard to Victoria's point. So yes, you're right. Yeah. Yeah. So your outfit, coffee, that, the things, things like that can be evaluated before you

[00:08:51] even answer a single question, which is so tough. And candidates, we get it and we see it and we feel it and we know it's insane. But a lot of interviewers have taken it a step further even and created secret tests. Should we talk about some of those? Yeah. Let's get psychological here. So the first one that comes to mind, and we've talked about this one quite a few times, but it's a classic, is the coffee cup test. Do you want to explain that one, Lorna? Yeah.

[00:09:19] So the coffee cup test is when a candidate gets to an interview, the hiring manager would offer them a cup of coffee. If they accept that cup of coffee, you go through the interview, the test is at the end. What does that candidate do with the cup? Do they leave it on the desk? Do they offer to take it back to the kitchen? Do they just take it back to the kitchen? Do they wash it? Who knows what they're asking them to do, but it's something along that line.

[00:09:48] So what do you think of this test? I think this test needs to be put in the dishwasher and put it on the garbage disposal. Garbage disposal. I think it's a bad test for so many reasons. I think the first one that comes to mind is that what is the right answer to this? What are we actually looking for? I would venture to guess it's probably dependent on the situation and the person, which makes it a bad test inherently right there. Don't you agree? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:10:23] I'm going to say this, that I know that 99.99% of the people that are conducting this test do not have any kind of training or background in psychology, any sort of thing. They're not doctors. And it's the stupidest test I've ever heard. Well, and from a candidate perspective, I might think going into their kitchen and putting something away is rude. I'm overstepping. I'm acting like that could be seen. I'm walking around. I own the place. I'm already acting like I have the job.

[00:10:52] There's so many things that would go through my mind. I could think leaving it there is actually the polite and right thing to do. Right. And so it's not just a secret test. It's a trick. It feels like it's a trap and a trick. And anytime it feels like that for either side to me, I'm like, what are we doing here? What is going on? Right. Right. So this one is one that just really gets to me so deep in my bones.

[00:11:18] And we were talking with a good friend, Brendan, from Workable, and he used the term psychological warfare when talking about this. And I couldn't agree more. The coffee cup test is psychological warfare. It is. Don't you forget it. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, just to imagine if the candidate were to, actually, this will relate to our next example here, but if candidate were to wear a pin on their jacket and say, well, the hiring manager doesn't say anything about my pin, I'm not going to work for them. Right.

[00:11:49] It's such a little thing that really makes no difference as to whether or not they can do this job. Yeah. I think the summary of the coffee cup test is terrible. Exactly. Yep. I think we nailed it. Yeah. There was another one, and you did a skit about this, and I loved it. The crumpled sort of paper or garbage.

[00:12:12] So the test is that the interviewer deliberately leaves a piece of crumpled paper on the floor to basically see if a candidate picks it up. The idea is, if you pick it up, you show initiative, awareness, good character. And then if you don't, you don't any of those things. Well, I don't know. What if I just don't want to pick up the garbage on a strange office floor? What does this tell you about the person, the whole situation? I mean, if they're interviewing for a janitor role, maybe. Sure. Maybe.

[00:12:42] If you're interviewing somebody that's going to be like your VP of software development, I'm like, you're joking. And the reasons I've heard that interviewers do things like this is like, are they going to take ownership? Are they going to pretend this place is theirs? Like, that this is their home, that we're a family here. It's like it's everyone's responsibility to keep the office clean. But I'm guessing that there are much more harder pressed qualifications rather than are you noticing the tissue that's left in the middle of the floor? Absolutely. It is a pet peeve of mine.

[00:13:11] I'm not going to lie to you. When I see someone walk by a piece of trash and they don't pick it up and I can see that they've seen it, it does anoint me. But would I not hire someone for that one thing? No. That would be insane behavior. I could be missing out on a top talent, a top performer. Or if I were to mention it, hey, you walked by that piece of trash. Next time, could you just pick it up? It's like I say that to my kids every week. It's no big deal. And then next time, guess what? Most of the time they do it because I've said it.

[00:13:40] It's very coachable. So I don't know. Somewhere in the ether, it got into hiring managers' heads that these secret tests reveal true character. And I just think it reveals more about their character than it does about the candidates. It does. It does. And part of it is that the most catching headlines, I mean, these headlines, they caught our attention. I'm going to be honest with you. Clearly. Because we love a good train wreck dumpster fire, as you mentioned.

[00:14:08] But it is also catching the eye of that interviewer who is out there thinking, evaluating talent's hard. Maybe this will be easier. They see this eye-catching stuff from a billion-dollar company and they're like, let's give it a shot. Yeah. And our 400-person company and see if it works. Little do they know, they are just disqualifying candidates for the stupidest reasons. Stupidest, for sure. Yeah.

[00:14:33] Now, I have one more that's coming to mind in this area that I want to ask about because I'm so curious what your take will be on this one. So this was the United Airlines CEO. Yeah. And he talked about he has respected pilots sort of evaluate other potential hires. So one of those components of that evaluation is if, quote, the respected pilots would want to spend a four-day trip with the person they're hiring.

[00:14:59] And they have veto power based on that qualification. So I'm curious. Pilots spend a lot of time together. Collaboration, it's important. Right. What are your thoughts? Okay. This is harder for me. This isn't as simple as, I hate this. This is stupid and dumb. So I have a family member. He runs their private jet for this company. And he is the one that's interviewing the people that he's going to be sitting next to in the cockpit.

[00:15:28] And so they're working together and they will go on trips together. You're going to be with this person overnight or multiple nights. I mean, obviously not in the same room, but you're working next to them and then you're living among them for a few days after. Now, in my mind, the most important part is can this person fly the plane? That's kind of critical. We kind of want to start there. So if we are saying that given the fact, if you had, this is going to be hard for me to say, Victoria,

[00:15:58] if we had two pilots who are both perfectly qualified and you liked one more than the other, I could see why they would hire them. Sure. Yeah. Doesn't that feel opposite of things that we talk about? It does. It hurts my brain. But I think what we're circling back to is though that there is a requirement of this job that you have to spend time, a significant amount of time with your coworker. And it's not just in an office setting. This is overnight. This is in life's running situations.

[00:16:27] Potentially, this is days at a time they're saying here. So maybe that's part of it. The part that I don't love about it that I wish we could unravel is what do you mean by want to spend a four-day trip? Let's define what that means. Is it that you'd love it and you'd have the best time ever? Or is it that you'd just be comfortable with it? Right. Is it that it would be enjoyable? It would be professional?

[00:16:53] I think I would just, I think I could get more on board with this if there was more of a clear definition. Because how my want might be different than your want might be different than their want. So that's my only issue is I think if we could come to, hey, these are the things we need, which feels kind of weird. They need to do X, Y, and Z. They can't be in a recluse who doesn't leave their house. I don't know. I'm just saying we just, we need something, something coming around. That's my only thing. Yeah.

[00:17:20] And now I'm going to argue with my past self about two and a half minutes ago. Okay. Here's the thing about this. Maybe those pilots just shouldn't have a say at all. And part of that is because I'm starting to think through this and I'm like, wait a second. Obviously, if I say that they're both qualified and biased is what gets the person the job, that eliminates other people being able to get into that industry.

[00:17:47] So I'm like, if that's part of the pilot's screening process, I don't think they should be a part of the process. So I can just see how it's a natural draw to hire somebody you'd want to spend four days with. I can understand that. But maybe that shouldn't be a part of the process. Well, I think the question is, can someone be really great at working with people without being someone that personally gets along with the one person they're talking to? And I think the answer to that question is yes. Yeah. So we know that.

[00:18:17] And we know that it's difficult to assess interpersonal skills without relying on your own personal biases and chemistry that you feel. So I think that's the battle. I feel like this one just has more nuance to it. I think that this one doesn't feel, you said it at the beginning, I don't think we're, I think that's what makes some of these things so interesting is the debate itself.

[00:18:37] And what's funny about the stories that we've been saying is that they've gathered so much attention from the interviewers who are paying attention to whether the candidates can meet their standards. And I'm, I feel like you and I are thinking, well, are these interviewers concerned if they're going to meet the candidates standards? Because they can't even meet, they probably wouldn't even meet their own standards, right? Exactly. They definitely wouldn't. What we've talked about so far is clearly questionable judgment. Should these hiring managers be basing decisions off these things?

[00:19:06] We're on the side of mostly no, they should not be. But then there's this transition point where it turns from questionable judgment to actual just terrible human behavior. There was this recent story, and it was just in October of this year, about a young candidate that described being yelled at during an interview. It was their second round with the company.

[00:19:29] The interviewer allegedly spent more than 20 minutes lecturing them about how young people don't understand professionalism. Oh my gosh, that's crazy. What? Define irony right here. Honestly, it's like, wait, are you yelling at me about professionalism? And you're putting me in a bucket with all of the people that are in my generation. I'm like, I'm supposed to speak on behalf of an entire generation to you?

[00:19:58] There's so many things wrong with that. Let's say this was your dream company. Victoria, would you go back for another interview if this happened? No, absolutely not. No. I think because an interview is a preview of what the experience is going to be like to work there. So if I'm getting yelled at in a first, second, third round interview, imagine being a full-time employee. That's probably light compared. Absolutely not. I'm not returning.

[00:20:26] I also just think, because I don't know if that person was the person that they'd be working for, but I'd be considering that. That would be my top concern as a candidate. Yeah. And rules reversed. Imagine a candidate yelling at hiring manager. I mean, it would never fly. It's just an insane, insane thing to do. Yeah. And clearly this came out because the candidate said something. Yeah. Now, very rarely will a company pull back the curtain to take a look at their own interviewing processes.

[00:20:54] And so I'm curious to know, what is worse? Is it the person that's screaming or the company that's allowing them to continue to interview these candidates? Well, it's hard and I'm not giving them a pass. It's just many times the company doesn't know these things are happening. They're not looking. They're not shadowing. They're not checking in. They're not training their employees to interview, which we know is critical. These things wouldn't happen if those things occur.

[00:21:20] So while I don't think, I think they're both at fault, I do think the person actually doing the thing is the one that I'm more frustrated with only because I don't think in this scenario there's a question of if yelling at someone is an appropriate thing to do or not. This isn't a gray area for me. But someone who asks an accidental illegal question, they might not have known that. So there's a little more nuance to that. But yeah, 100% to me.

[00:21:45] It's the person doing the yelling, but in general, I think that everybody just needs more awareness around this and there just needs to be more transparency because with that, then you would know more for sure. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I don't think training would fix that person. Therapy might, but training would not. And I do think that there's a massive company responsibility to know that this is happening before the candidate spills it to the Internet.

[00:22:14] And I'm like, they have to know that this is going on. This person is probably yelling at their own employees and willingly shove that person in front of external candidates. That's fair. I think that some people, though, might be like, well, yeah, he's like that with us, but he wouldn't be like that with someone he just met in the interview. I think there are. I think that's a logic. There was another one, too, a viral story about a hiring manager who was trashing a current employee, calling them useless, criticizing them.

[00:22:40] And the candidate considered warning the employee. What are your thoughts on that? So, yeah, a hiring manager who is trashing their current employee is, I mean, it's kind of like dating somebody who's trashing their ex-girlfriend. Like, are they the crazy one or are you the crazy one? I'm pretty sure it's you. But it's clearly very, very gross. Would you warn the employee? Would you warn them? Would you say anything?

[00:23:10] If I knew who they were, I think, God, I'd like to think that I would. I've never been in that situation before. Would you warn them? Not my circus, not my monkeys. If it's just an interview, I kind of feel like I'm staying out of it. But I, but to your point, if I knew the person, that's a different story. I'm saying if I don't know the person and this is a company that I'm interviewing for, I'm not getting in the middle of that. Heck no. I don't want to be contacted with a lawsuit down the road. I'm good. I don't want to get involved. I want to stay out of it, which might make me a bad person.

[00:23:40] I'm sorry. But I just feel like I have enough going on. So I don't know if that makes me. To stick your face in that drama. Yeah. And there's causes that I care about that I will go out of my way to do that. But in this instance, I'm kind of like, y'all work it out. This seems like a family beef. Y'all got to handle it. That's how I feel. It is a clear red flag.

[00:23:59] And then if we're going to adopt the same methodology to interviewers, if a candidate were trashing every, their last employer for whatever reason, it is a little bit of a cause for concern. Because you're like, what was really going on there? It's just not good either way. I think we have one more that came to when we were doing our research and pulling these together.

[00:24:21] There was one more, a viral email from a company where they rejected a candidate after the CEO had arrived over an hour late to the interview and they didn't apologize for arriving late. Candidates are disqualified for arriving late all the time. Would you stay for an hour? I wouldn't. No, I think after the first 10 minutes, I'd be sending emails like, is this happening? And of course, we'd always do that thing. Was this my bad? Did I make a mistake somewhere? Even though you don't have everything is perfect. Exactly.

[00:24:51] Based on the meeting invite, you see it in your calendar. It's on time. At that 10 minute mark, you're like, what the heck is happening? And then you're gone after that. The fact that candidates stayed there for an hour is amazing in itself and shocking. Oh, do you remember? This brings up another bad interviewer behavior. How people, hiring managers would make candidates sit in the waiting room for a long time. And then whoever won was still there at the end was the one that got the job. I'm like, God, I hate you guys so much. I hate you so much. It's so bad.

[00:25:20] Could there ever be a reason why an acceptable explanation for an interviewer being an hour late from your lens? A car accident. I don't mean to laugh. Someone's injured. I'm with you. I'm having a tough time of thinking of other reasons. Do you have any other reasons? I don't. I do think there's grace to be given on both sides.

[00:25:48] As long as the person who's late is also giving grace on the other side, I think I'm okay with that. I'm okay with a candidate having to wait or whatever. I also just think the oftentimes, what's the saying? The cover-up is worse than the crime. I think how you handle it afterwards is really what is going to determine if it's acceptable or not. So in this instance that we're talking about, they did not apologize. And I'm going to say he because it definitely was a he in my opinion. But whatever.

[00:26:15] It's just if you're not apologizing, if you were not respecting that person by having that conversation, then automatic hard no, hard pass. Yep. It's just showing that genuine care as a human. To be a human and apologize is a big deal. Now, there are some really bad judgment calls. There are really bad just plain old human behaviors. But there's also just really bad interview questions that we've heard that can ruin an entire experience.

[00:26:45] One of them that came up. I was like, let's run through them. Just rapid fire. I'm so serious. Yeah. A published article was saying that they had asked the candidate, can I see your ChatGPT history? Insane behavior. And that's such a modern, weird question. But I mean, like, that one's very modern. And no. Yeah. That's between me and the big one. That's it. Nobody else is seeing that.

[00:27:13] God, would you ever want to do that to another level? And that's like, that's more modern. I think some of the other ones that we have. Are you expecting? Or when are you due? Those ones aren't insane. But those are traditional old school ones that we've heard forever. Yes, they are. Doesn't make them any less horrible and horrific. Totally. Yeah. Yeah. Are you comfortable working with someone that's younger than you? How close to retirement are you? Things like that.

[00:27:37] I mean, those are the stupidest questions that most interviewers could just avoid by going on to exploring protected characteristics and not touching those questions with a 10-foot pole. But some of them are just, like you said, modern stupidity. Common sense. You shouldn't say that to your neighbor. You shouldn't say some of this stuff to anybody. What are we doing here? And by the way, the tides are turning. And this is something that I personally love about social media. I think there's a lot of things that people can criticize about it.

[00:28:05] But one thing it's giving us is exposure and transparency. And candidates are finally able to share their experiences, put these people on blast. And sometimes they're not even finishing the interviews. So I actually love hearing and seeing these stories. I always take them with a grain of salt, just like everything on both sides. But I think it's just very interesting to hear and see accurate representations of what's actually going on out there. Yeah. I love that some candidates are being empowered to walk out.

[00:28:34] So at what point, I guess, candidates are sharing these experiences and then some are not participating in the AI interviews or the crazy, they'll walk out if the person's late, et cetera. I'm just curious how you're feeling about some of that. We've had, there was a viral story where the hiring manager asked one interview question describing sort of an expectation of working. You did a skit about this, working an insane amount of hours and they don't track overtime. And rather than continue, he just stopped the interview, the candidate, and just said,

[00:29:04] hey, this isn't going to be a match. Do you respect that decision? I highly respect it. And that person's bravery. You know how awkward it is to sit in an interview and there's a clear power dynamic there. That person who's the interviewer is in clear control of what's happening here. And so to have the guts to step up and be like, you know what? I'm out. Especially in the job market for candidates to step up and it's like, this is not acceptable. I'm out of here. And I'm going to roast you on the internet.

[00:29:33] I'm proud of that person. Me too. I don't know if I could do it, but I'm very proud of them. Yeah. And I think the way that they had done it in that article is very respectful too. And I think again, on all sides, if you're being professional and respectful, I don't have a problem with it. I think it's saving both people a ton of time. We are huge fans of saving time and not wasting people's times in interviews. That's it. Time is a non-renewable resource. Why are we wasting it?

[00:29:59] So is there a limit to what candidates should share about an interview process online? Or is it free game? No. All the interviewers out there, every single interviewer, if you're listening, don't do anything you wouldn't want them to talk about on the internet. Yep. That's a good rule of thumb. And vice versa, candidates, by the way, don't be doing stuff that you don't want a hiring manager to go on and talk about that you did on an interview.

[00:30:25] I had an interview once recently that a candidate answered a video call shirtless on his bed. So if you're going to do that, sir, I am going to talk about it. So don't do that. And then it won't be talked about. And when we talk about has the internet made interviewing better or worse, I think that's something you and I actually haven't talked about much. I'm so curious what you think. Do you think this has helped? Hurt? A little bit of both?

[00:30:54] So in some capacity, I do think that hiring managers are getting terrible interview advice from the internet in general. So that hurts. Yeah. But God, do I love the megaphone that candidates have now to call this out. So I see it on both sides. What do you think? All day, every day, I'd rather have the light being shown on some of these things. And with that is going to come some of the risks that you mentioned, bad advice.

[00:31:23] I think about the people in our comments that are just absolutely awful, that write horrible things about where we should go and what we should be doing with our advice and all of this and calling us inappropriate names. And I think there's other people who are reading those comments going, okay, yeah, see, I'm not the only one. And that's not great. We don't want them to know there's other people out there that have their terrible opinions. But that's just, I think, a part of the game. So I say that these viral stories have definitely helped more than they've hurt.

[00:31:53] And I don't think they're going to stop anytime soon, whether anybody likes it or not. I think Pandora's box is open. Totally. Totally. Not going to stop. So final questions for us. Of all these stories, which one would you avoid the very, very most? Which one would you refuse to work for? Honestly, the yelling one didn't bother me that much, only because I used to go to Orange Theory. I like a boot camp workout class where they kind of yell at you. So I could get down with that, honestly. It's not bad. There were so many horrible ones.

[00:32:22] I think what's hard is like, I probably, some of them I wouldn't know about until after the coffee cup test or things like the secret tests I just wouldn't know about. I wouldn't want to work for someone who did that or to work in a place that did that, but it just, it wouldn't be something that I would know about. Does that make sense? So I think the late one would probably for sure be a shoo-in for me if the person doesn't apologize and doesn't explain it. I know that's not the worst offense, but I just think I would recognize in the moment, I'm thinking very realistically, that would be the one that I would walk out of for sure.

[00:32:52] Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. Just so you know, mine is for sure the yelling one. It would crush my soul and I'd be gone. Well, and all the bad questions like, can I see your chat GBT history? Are you expecting? In my instance, I wouldn't even get there. I wouldn't even get to that point because I'm not saying those people are the same. Totally. Yeah. I get that. You are the same person. But yeah. Any misogynistic questions, I would be sick to my stomach and never work for them ever. Yeah.

[00:33:21] I already know the answer to this, I think, but I'm so curious. If you could wave a magic wand and you banned one of these bad practices from ever happening again to candidates, what would you do? Which one? The psychological warfare ones. Okay. That's what I would be. I thought you were going to say the illegal questions. For sure. Yeah. I feel like, yeah. That one's easier fix? You think that one's easier fix? I do think that. Yeah. It's harder to convince somebody that they're not a doctor than it is to have them go on and check out protected characteristics. What about you?

[00:33:51] What's the one that you would ban for life? I would have said the illegal questions. That's what I thought. I thought we were going to be aligned only because I think those ones just are so harmful on both sides and we're so bored of it. Just educate yourself on these. It's really, we can help. There's plenty. It's available public information what the protected characteristics are. I don't know. Part of me is just that one. That one feels like if I could just, it's similar to note taking. It was one of those things that was painful that we had to teach people when we first started interview training.

[00:34:19] And it's like, there's a solution for that with AI note taking now and it's amazing and that feels like a magic wand kind of thing. So I would do the same thing here. Yeah. Protected characteristics. We're not gatekeeping that. It's not behind a paywall. No. Google it and don't ask those questions. Exactly. So, well, after all that, I think it's fair to say candidates aren't the only ones showing up to interviews with red flags. And some of these stories are ridiculous, but the bigger problem is that people are making actual hiring decisions this way. Exactly.

[00:34:50] The goal isn't to catch someone doing something wrong. It's to figure out whether they can do the job and want to do the job. And maybe make sure that you're not the reason they don't want it. Until next time, everyone. Happy interviewing.